[...] with their children’s education. This one really got my hackles up, and that’s what I’m ranting about over at Babble this morning. Share and [...]

The legislation seems a little much. But, I do agree that parental involvement has a direct and pretty amazing impact on a child’s educational experience, and success. HUGE. I work full-time, but try to volunteer in my son’s classroom about 5 hours a month…that’s all I have to offer. But, it’s something. And I love it. He sees my passion for school and learning, and it catches on like wildfire. My son is a high-level thinker for a five year old and I can’t help but think that my time and interest in HIS school year has made all the difference. I’m so proud of him and he sees that in my eyes when I’m there. School rocks!…so does sitting with your child for 20 minutes at lunch — priceless. :)

Me again…Gretchen: I totally agree that people think public education is a right. It should be viewed as more of a privilege. Excellent point.

I have to agree with Gretchen, Katie. This isn’t meant for you, or for the vast majority of busy, working parents. You go to conferences. You send your children to school well-rested, well-fed, and well-prepared. Is there a chance that some teachers will take this too far and use it to judge parents who don’t constantly volunteer? Sure. Do I like that it’s being legislated? Not particularly. But I’ll bet most teachers are far more concerned with their students who come to school without pencils and pens to give you anything but a satisfactory rating.

This is one of the reasons that I will homeschool. Get the government the hell out of my life. Yes, I think there are many parents out there than need to involve themselves more. But this is NOT the way to do it…a parent’s job is to parent. But we have the right to decide HOW, WHEN and how MUCH to involve ourselves in our childs lives as well. Sadly, there are many parents out there that choose to NOT be involved in their kids lives – but that is NOT something for the government to get involved in or to mandate. Unless they are also going to get involved in WHO is allowed to become a parent, which is a completely different discussion….

There’s no consequence related to a low rating, I see. If they are in fact trying to target parents who don’t show the level of interest and involvement they desire, I’m not sure how it will help. It will be insulting, for one thing, and there’s no motivating factor inherent to the program (Why bother setting up a conference to get your grade up? Who cares? Not you, probably, if you’re getting a crappy grade already…) except that maybe the school won’t send you an insult on the next report card?

I don’t like this, and I don’t think it will make an impact at all.

Another example of overreaching by the government. We all know that there are parent’s out there who are not involved at all. So, you’re going to give the parent a bad grade??? Another label for the child to deal with down the road…”in third grade your parents obviously didn’t give a rip about you because mom got an F in involvement”. What if that mom’s husband had just left her; she had cancer and recently lost her house in a foreclosure?? Does she get extra points for that. This idea is just beyond ludicrous.

The real problem here — and someone else may have already addressed this in their comments — is that the parents for whom this legislation would be passed wouldn’t be affected by it because if they don’t care, they don’t care. Sure, there are kids who show up to school without breakfast or who haven’t done their homework. If it really IS an issue of a parent who doesn’t care and not a poverty/work situation, then does the legislature really think that giving those parents a GRADE is going make them care all of a sudden?

The bill clearly targets low-income families. There are of course lots of anecdotes (true anecdotes) about kids showing up to school with no breakfast (hence, free breakfast programs for low-income kids), poor hygiene, etc. All that is a shame, but this bill is a means of shaming parents and endangering parental rights. What I think is dangerous about this bill is its potential for being used to remove children from the custody of their rightful parents. Sometimes that is obviously necessary, but allowing teachers to evaluate a parent’s performance based on a kid’s performance in school is a terrible idea. There are way too many legit reasons for why children perform poorly other than parenting, and why parents have a hard time making time for school obligations, so I see a dangerous potential. But yeah, I agree that this has nothing to do with middle class white mothers’ commitment to bake sales or school coupons.

As long as they also have a section for parents to grade the teachers, the aides, the non-teaching staff, the administration and the school in the following areas:

• Satisfactory curriculum as compared to national rankings (ie: no more University of Chicago Everyday Math!)
• Effective teaching manner
• School is updated and contains adequate equipment and technology
• Timely and thorough communication with parents
• Efficient processing of special education plans, medical plans, etc.
• Zero to little class time used for fundraiser rallies
• Zero to little nanny-programs as opposed to REAL instruction time

@ Gretchen: “If you’re doing your job as a parent, you’ve got nothing to worry about. ”
One can say that about any number of intursions on your privacy as well. IT’ the principle of the idea.
“People think public education is a right. It should be viewed as more of a privilege.”
Um, NOT when over 60% of my local property tax goes to the local school district, not to mention state and federal tax dollars. That makes ME a voice in that system, and holds that system accountable for doing a good job.

i’m not trying to be callous or a smart-ass, but this is what always surprises me about the workings of the mind of a liberal. and for the life of me, i cannot understand it. you all (none of you personally, but rather those of a particular mind-set) seem to be perfectly okay with government intrusion into your lives until the point that you’re not and then you have a fit and use lots of exclamation points. so, the government can mandate that you carry health insurance and can basically make health care and health care insurance decisions for you, but they can’t give you a grade on your participation in your child’s education? how and where do you draw the line on how much control of your own lives you are willing to hand over to someone else? you realize, don’t you, that allowing “them” control over anything gives “them” a foot in the door into everything, right? that old saying “give them an inch and they’ll take a foot” ain’t an old saying for nothing.

I am kind of intrigued by the fact that half the responses to this assert that since you won’t be impacted by this, you shouldn’t care. Doesn’t that seem problematic?

And one of the hallmarks of our country is that we have long viewed public education as a right. In many countries in the world, the fact that education is viewed as a privilege means that children never escape the cycle of poverty. This is such an important issue that the UN lists it as a Universal Right (Article 26) and as one of its eight Millennium Goals.

Is it frustrating that some parents, who are capable enough, don’t step up to the plate? Absolutely. But there are far more parents who simply don’t have the resources to address some of these issues, and unless the legislation addresses that problem, it does nothing.

(I also suspect the law of unintended consequences will also show up to the party if this is passed.)

“….how and where do you draw the line on how much control of your own lives you are willing to hand over to someone else? you realize, don’t you, that allowing “them” control over anything gives “them” a foot in the door into everything, right? that old saying “give them an inch and they’ll take a foot” ain’t an old saying for nothing.”

For sure, evaluating legislation and weighing the costs, benefits, risks, etc. is the duty of every citizen, and hard work for the simple-minded.

It’s not about not caring because it’s not about me, it’s that these are basic things all parents should be doing anyway and the reason they feel a need to legislate this is because, clearly, it’s not being done by enough parents. People need to be less defensive about being “shamed” or “judge” and worry about doing right by their kids. I call bullshit on this silly middle class pretending to be worried about shaming “poor people”, too. “Poor people” can take care of these basics, too, if they put effort in. What this legislation, as posted by Katie, describes is the bare minimum. And, I realize that as tax payers we have a say in how the system is run, but we have a responsibility, too. I hear an awful lot about how people don’t want to be made to do this or that but not about what they SHOULD be doing. Like the example of the note from the teacher saying kids should have hats, gloves, scarves if it’s cold. Well, yes, that is common sense, but there are some real spaced-out assholes who need to be reminded of things like this. I know. Pitiful, but true. I don’t buy the “parents don’t have the resources” to make sure there kids has enough sleep, eats breakfast or is in the breakfast program, gets to school on time and is not excessively absent, does their homework. And, since there are no consequences to the grade, the legislation is just providing an entre to discussing issues that may be going on with the school, or perhaps a social worker so that maybe the problems can be fixed. Y’all want the government to give you everything (pubic education, healthcare, etc.) which I am on board with, but, yeah, you’re going to need to be held accountable for what you get. Don’t like it? Send your kid to private school. Oh, can’t afford it? OK. The rules are probably stricter there, anyway.

Katie, I agree that grading parents is a pretty ridiculous idea. However, as other commenters have stated, I don’t think this legislation was targeted to your demographic. I am a teacher in a large TN inner-city school with little to no parental involvement. We had a Parent-Teacher night a few weeks ago where we gave out report cards and there were only three families in attendance. We have over 1000 students at our school. We realize that our parents don’t always work 9 to 5, so we schedule conferences basically anytime from 6 in the morning to 10 at night. No one comes. Parents often dodge our phone calls and ignore urgent requests for conferences. If this legislation brings the issue of parental involvement to the forefront, then great.

@ julie – thank you for taking the time to answer my question and enlighten this poor simple minded person. your thoughtful response has put this issue to bed for me. thanks.

for those of you who have a response as to where your comfort level line is, please help me out here. i truly don’t get it. i agree with most of you regarding the proposed legislation being a waste of time. and yes, grading schools and teachers is an excellent idea.

but again, how are some of you comfortable with a bureaucracy having control over certain aspects of your life but yet you take such umbrage over what seems to be a trivial thing?

Wendi, what you are seeing is the immaturity and lack of intellectual integrity on the part of many liberals. They want it all, but they don’t want to have to do anything for it. I think this is why we can’t have the same kind of successful social programs they do in Europe. The people here are not earnest enough.

I live in Canada and our powers that be always seem to look south of the border for trends to follow, so I really hope this doesn’t pass. As a teacher who is now the parent of a school-aged child, I realize how ridiculous this is! Yes, parental involvement is one of the major contributors to school success for children. But let’s think about those parents who are involved… they have time (=money) to devote to their children at key times of the day and they are generally more educated than those parents who don’t have the time (or knowledge) to support/help their children. No surprise that their children do better. Higher socio-economic status! So this law would then just punish families at the lower end of the socio-economic scale, as if they aren’t struggling enough to hold down a job, put food on the table, make ends meet with meager funds. I also take the approach that I support my child with home reading programs, signing her daily agenda, communicating with the teachers regularly, etc., but when it comes to homework and projects I am quite hands off. If I do it all for her, how will she ever learn to do it on her own?! Natural consequences if she doesn’t do her homework or else she’ll never care. My two cents worth.

Public education is a privilege??? No, it is not. In this country it is a right, and one that the children who don’t have parents who are uber-involved need more than anyone. And I find it a little ironic, although totally predictable, that the Republicans who want less government intrustion in our lives would come up with a bill like this. Yes, parental involvement in school is important. But I also know that the mother who works the overnight shift at the bakery and who relies on public transportation probably isn’t going to be able to be as involved at the school as I am. And the parent who works for an hourly wage is going to lose money if he has to take off work to come to a parent-teacher conference. And I also know these parents are looked down on by many of those who my husband calls the “Mommy Mafia,” who are at the school every day. This bill is just a way for the MM types to feel superior and those who don’t have the luxury of spending their days micromanaging their children’s lives feel inferior.

Or, GP, the people here like freedom a little too much and trust their own judgement when it comes to their own lives too much. Yes some people are inconsistent in this value, both on the right and the left, but it’s still a fairly common American sentiment.

A classical liberal (and that includes quite a few of us who often vote Republican) would be appalled by this measure.

@wendi- didn’t most of the conservatives also support the Patriot Act- the one that gave the government all osrts of power into our private lives? Don’t the conservatives want to govern the wombs of women? Seems pretty disingenuous to label liberals pick-n-choosers…..

GP…by your logic, a bad teacher could just give a good deal of the students’ parents a poor grade and therefore pass the buck. “Look, ten of these parents got Fs. How can you expect me to be effective?” If it were going to work at all for identifying which kids’ failure was the fault of the parents, you’d need someone other than the teacher to do the grading.

Here’s some thumb sketches of legislation being pursued by school districts across our nation directed at parents

Cali:fine not to exceed $2000 and/or country jail not to exceed 1year

Houston: 5th grade parents for receive $180 for regularly attending conferences and incentives for involvement and the students math scores. Payments could amount to $1020 per year.

Detroit: 3 days for repeated absents

Newberg $242 citations for truancy

W. Virg: yank parent’s driver’s license for 10 days absent

My opinion is that as with everything their are two sides to the story.

Yes teachers are frustrated by parent’s seeming uninterested in their child’s education during their elementary and high school years.

Parents who are deemed “too” involved in their child’s college education are called helicopter parents, because they “hover” too much by college educators.

Teachers don’t want to be “graded” by their student’s standardized test scores.

Parents want a system that can fire teachers and administrators who are immune from dismissal because of the current tenure policies.

Having said all that let me add: My son is a teacher. He is in his second year. He’s a great guy but why is he a teacher? He has a 4 year degree in Math. He took one certification test and viola he was given a classroom.

He never took one class in how to BE a teacher. He was audited once a month and assigned a mentor his first year. He is an involved teacher. He instructs the math club and the chess club. However, he is trying to learn the skill of teaching his subject to people who are not naturally proficient. His biggest complaint: parents who don’t show up at conferences. He didn’t like my asking him how he would feel if someone told him that their child was “losing” a year of education while he was learning how to be a teacher, but it did give him pause.

All this seems to me to just be a push back from educators from the back lash of Waiting for Superman.

JTTH…I thought you were smart, but you’re just being ridiculous. There is an APPEAL process, and parents are not going to take a bad grade if the teacher sucks…sounds like this is another point showing it could encourage ENGAGEMENT, which is really what it’s about. (And I don’t really think that there are crazy “bad” teachers out there who are going to create a paper trail of lies about bad parents where there are not bad parents…) Anyway, if you don’t like it, you do always have the option to send your kids to private school, or, gasp, homeschool them! But that would require some MAJOR involvement in their lives that people clearly don’t have time for. People, public school is not an extension of your daycare programs…and school is not daycare for big kids. It’s school. You have to play a role.

Katie, I know you have a little libertarian spot down deep in your heart. Every once in a while I see it glimmer. (Don’t hide it under a bushel, girl; let it shine.)

Of course this is asinine. And it isn’t “great” for all those moms who happen to have the time to be at school and help their kids with work. I chose to leave a professional job and stay home when my first son was born 6 years ago. I have all the time in the world. Do I spend it at school? No. I take care of my younger son, so he can have the same advantages his older brother had. School isn’t for me. My schoolchild knows that he must be well behaved and do his best work, which requires doing whatever the teacher asks. Those are his responsibilities. The government should not grade me, but if they do, they can keep the results to themselves. I frankly don’t care what they think of me.

By the way, not a lot of people are considering the teachers here. My dad is a 30 year veteran and believe me, this kind of thing is a nuisance and a distraction from the real tasks at hand.

I haven’t read all the comments, so I apologize for that in advance. However, I do agree with some of the early comments that said “this legislation isn’t for you.” They’re right. However …

Schools are funded by property taxes. So you have your “good” schools in the “good” neighborhoods and the “bad” schools in the “bad” ones. It is a very class-based system. This is legislation that is going to impact families that already have quite a bit of stress, socio-economically. It is also protecting the teachers in a way, by allowing them to say “see? our school isn’t failing your kids. you are!”

I don’t mean to be callous to teachers. I taught for two years in a very poor city. My kids came to school hungry, witnessed gang fights on their street the night before, had all kinds of family strife going on that made my lessons not the biggest priority for them. Reach back to your intro to psychology and sociology classes in college–remember Maslow’s hierarchy of needs? Yeah, if you’re hungry or scared, you don’t really care about taking a standardized test. The best I could do was create a safe place for them and let them play, and hope maybe they learned a little bit too. I probably failed those kids. I know they taught me more than I ever taught them. And notice I’m not a teacher anymore …

I now live in a very rural area, but in a college town. So there is great disparity in the schools–kids with parents who are highly educated and invested in their children’s education, and kids who aren’t very well socialized with parents who don’t really believe in education. I mean, when a kindergarten class has some kids who come to class already reading, and some kids who can’t sit still for even five minutes, what is a teacher supposed to do? How does a kindergartener have a successful school experience when, at 5 or 6, she already makes regular visits to the principal’s office? And if her parents get an “F” or whatever on their report cards, are they even going to care? I think they have other concerns, valid or not, that distract them.

If they’re a little too fucking busy with WORK, and other actual necessities, to go through an APPEAL process, the parents WILL take a bad grade, especially if it has no personal consequences, and even more if they don’t realize that poor teachers are using it to pass the buck! And how exactly are you going to prove that your kid ate breakfast/wore a coat/had a pencil on a day the teacher says he didn’t? It’s your word against the teachers.

DO NOT play the “if you don’t like it, use private school” card on me. I do use private school for my daughter because the public school’s attitude toward children with special needs is absolutely disgusting. I would HAPPILY put all my kids in private school if the district would hand me back the money I fork over in taxes so I could darn well afford private school. I can’t pay twice for all my kids.

“Homeschool, but that might take major involvement in their lives…” FU. Seriously. How about homeschooling might take skills and abilities I don’t have. I’m not a teacher. I didn’t go to four years of college that teachers are supposed to have. Or are you going to ammend your usual refrain of “don’t have so many kids if you can’t breastfeed/stay home three years/buy organic food…” to include “don’t have kids if you’re not a certified teacher?”

FTR, I have nothing against homeschooling for people who are capable of it. I’m not; misspelled words give me seizures. But seriously, I think I’m plenty able to be a good parent without being a good K-6 teacher.

Dear Chatel, et al.
Read the legislation (or at least what Katie cut and pasted as the legislation).
Thanks,
Gretchen

What do you people mean, “education should be a privilege”? WHAT?! Education is most *definitely* a right. Making it a “privilege” makes the kids of less-than-involved parents suffer, not those parents themselves. Good god.

@ Anna, It means that people should feel grateful that there are public schools that they can send their children to and they should work as part of a community to support the schools and do their job as parents to ensure their kids show up ready to learn, are well-behaved at school, etc. Too many stories I hear of unruly kids with horrible home lives that teachers have to deal primarily with disciplinary and sociological issues when their job, truly, is to EDUCATE them, not to feed them, not to discipline them or be their psychologist, etc. Education is NOT a “right,” it is a nice, good thing that a civilized country like America SHOULD provide to its citizens (like healthcare), however, THE PEOPLE need to do their share, as well.

Geesh, this has turned into a bitch fest. Please take these extra minutes you have to complain on this blog and go check out your child’s school. Volunteer. Cut out some stencils. Read a book to a child. This isn’t about politics, it’s about children and families. It’s about OUR future.

While it’s nice to say “this is from a middle class perspective” and “some parents do suck, this isn’t about you” I sincerely doubt this would be applied to ONLY bad parents and this kind of legislation is NOT going to make parents who already suck suddenly get better. No it’s going to have the exact effect Katie says, freaking out the already over burdened. I mean really you think someone who feels comfortable sending a kid to school with an empty stomach and inappropriate dress is going to give a hoot what a teacher gives them for a grade? I mean what’s the punishment? Repeating Parenting Grade 4? All it will do is make crappy parents scream at their kids to not make them look bad in public “Stop telling teacher I don’t feed you!”

At that point, I’d just homeschool. And I hate homeschooling. A whole lot.

@Kelly: not my strength. I “do” School Board meetings. I advocate for better curricula. And I work from home to fund their college educations- (One done, 2 to go). And then I help my own younger children with their homework AND supplement for the crappy math curricula that they will not change. I am most assuredly concerned with the future of education- but cutting out stencils is not my area of strength. It takes people in all areas to effect change.

“I do agree that parental involvement has a direct and pretty amazing impact on a child’s educational experience, and success.”

What she said….

Also, I agree with the person who noted that people who are not willing to invest their time in their children should limit the number of children they have. Parenting by “benign neglect” crushes children.

As a teacher (not teaching this year, so don’t worry that I’m using tax dollars to look at blogs), I think that this is a fantastic idea. Katie, the fact that you have a parenting blog, spend time thinking about parental issues etc puts you light-years head of the game. This idea was meant for parents who treat their local public schools like free drop zone day care for their child. The ones that leave their kid at school hours past the bell without any communication. The parents who send their kid to school with shoes that require duct tape to stay one, but are sporting a new iPhone. The parents who send their kid on the first day of kindergarten with a bloated go-gurt and a rock in their backpack (TRUE STORY). The parents who will NEVER answer the phones no matter how urgent the matter. The parents who force their children to get left behind while everyone else goes on a free field trips because they won’t sign the permission slip no matter how many times I call or how many extra slips I pin to their child’s clothing. These are the parents this idea is based around. Sure, parents have other lives and things going on and they make mistakes. Teachers don’t really want helicopter parents anyway. But teachers have a job to do, and when crappy parents don’t do their job well, it makes it really hard for me to do mine!

One more thing – overall, there really isn’t any enforceable parental accountability. If you feed, cloth, and get your child to school, then that’s enough. It takes so much more to raise a productive member of society that can thrive on their own.

It really is hard to take a good look at your own parenting and examine it. What I hear is a lot of “I’m already doing that”

I agree with whomever said that the parents who will be receiving bad grades probably aren’t going to care that much anyway… but SOMETHING has to be done.

this is a really tough topic.

@Goddess: Perhaps you could try stenciling the math program you’re advocating for across your Board members foreheads?

ROFLMAO Kelly- think it would work?

@Goddess – It’s worth a try! ;)

Marie, what grade does your son teach? In many states I am familiar with, highschool teachers don’t need a degree in education, but elementary school teachers do. This legislation is for pre-K through 3rd grade (another point many seem to miss in their ranting). During these very early years of a child’s education it is even more important that the parent is involved and making sure the child is rested, fed, etc. They’re not grading parents on Jr. High or HS kids, who, yeah, can make their own breakfast and be responsible for their own homework. The amount of resistance against what appears to be a desperate cry for help from the teachers and schools is crazy.

Also, Katie’s comment at 10:04 to me shows an assumption that the people whom she trusts to educate her children will necessarily behave unprofessionally by misusing the reporting and extending it to other areas (that she then explains are beneath her, as a working woman, or that she is simply too busy for). Maybe the neighborhood biddies will judge you, but I doubt the teachers would. So, are these people good enough for you to entrust your children’s education to, or are they not? And if not, shouldn’t you be finding alternatives…this is all hypothetical because it’s not YOUR school…but you see what I mean, hopefully….Perhaps teachers and school administrators should be given the benefit of the doubt that they will act as professionals until they demonstrate otherwise.

Perhaps parents should be given the benefit of the doubt that they will be acting in the best interests of their children until THEY demonstrate otherwise. Then the school may judge/grade those who have demonstrated a need for it.

“Fair”? I refuse to be reduced to the lowest common denominator. This is akin to the schools in St. Paul dictating what is put in children’s lunches. If I bake fresh brownies from scratch, you betcher ya yas I might put one in my kids’ lunches, school be damned!

The sentiment is: teach my child, *I* will do the parenting.
And like making rules about school lunches (dictating my parenting choices), I refuse to be *graded* on my *performance* (another implied dictation of what I should/should not be doing as a parent).
And I’d rather my child have a treat n the afternoon when they have more time to burn it off than in the evening closer to bedtime. My kids are lean, fit and healthy as far as weight, the foods they eat and their cardiovascular health, and it is not the school’s place to *nanny* my kids. And it’s not in the place of the teachers to “rate-a-parent” across the board. You have a problem with a parent’s involvement,take it up with them individually.
Again, *MY* parenting choices, and as the taxpayer/employer of these school systems and their employees, I will make my voice heard.

They’re not rating your parenting “across the board”. Did you not read about what they would be grading? It says what they’d be grading and again, I reiterate for the slow folks, these are BASIC things. My brother is a teacher and he has had children tell him they are hungry and they can’t focus. He asked if they had breakfast. They didn’t. They weren’t signed up for the breakfast program. My brother BROUGHT CEREAL INTO CLASS for the kids. (Some kind of logistics where they couldn’t get signed up for the program promptly). Kids are falling asleep in school because their parents let them stay up til whenever they want watching TV, or whatever. Teachers wait like assholes for a parent to show up to their conference, and parent’s don’t call and say they’re not going to make it, etc. Meanwhile, MY kids have to sit in a classroom and have THEIR time wasted when they should be learning because someone else is not doing their job with the basics, making the teacher have to spend extra time on these neglected kids. THAT is why I would “judge” another parent, that is why I think this legislation is fine. Like I said, if you’re doing the right things, you’ve got nothing to worry about.

Your brother didn’t call CPS when kids showed up unfed? And your brother’s school doesn’t just feed the kids, regardless of whether they’ve signed up? I know that I didn’t set up a cafeteria account for my kids, and when my son decided he wanted Coco Puffs (!) one morning in the school’s cafeteria, after he had oatmeal at home, the lunch ladies just gave it to him, put it on his account, and then sent home a note saying that if he racked up $10 of charges without payment, they’d still give him a cold cheese sandwich and a carton of milk. So, I call shenanigans, there.

But, really, GP, no one objects to the idea that parents who ARE neglecting their kids be called on it and prosecuted. Of course when kids fall asleep in class, are disruptive, etc. it hurts all the kids. But how does grading a parent on “the basics”, if there is no consequence for a poor parent grade, help that?

They can grade me as a parent when I can grade them as teachers.

Speaking as a teacher, rest assured it is not our goal or desire to grade parents; in fact our goal is not to test and grade students every waking hour, our focus is to teach. However, the politicians in Tallahassee don’t want us to teach; they want us to test, score, grade, and label. Just as they constantly test, score, grade, and label us and PUBLIC schools, note the word PUBLIC, because private schools have none of this oversight. Somewhere our elected officials have come up with the notion that students are manufactured on an assembly line, each prepared to exact specifications to gather knowledge in a set, prescribed, uniform and consistent pattern. And if your students don’t, then you’re a BAD teacher. Well, I don’t know where this child assembly line is that the politicians are looking at, but will someone let them know they need to review their specs, because this is not what is coming to school.

The day our only child graduated from high school was right up there with the day he was born as one of my happiest. NEVER AGAIN were we going to have to deal with this school system. I parent at home, teach my kid at school. I did my own homework when I went to school. The expectations the teachers had were totally unrealistic. If everything is going well with him in class, kindly leave me the hell alone. And yes, public education in this country is a RIGHT. Where the hell are you from GP?

But…grading ISN’T reaching out and saying “here, let me help you” it’s just saying “hey, yer doin it wrong” and putting parents on the defensive.

The reaction does say a lot. I don’t think, though, that it’s saying what you think it is. Good parents, who have decent social skills and parenting abilities are feeling defensive, and a feeling of defensiveness doesn’t usually help a relationship between parents and teachers, or for that matter between patients and doctors or among any other teams that are working toward a common goal. If *good* parents are getting this upset and defensive, how do you think the insecure, self-loathing, dysfunctional ones are going to handle it?

There are processes in place for identifying “at risk” kids and helping them, well before CPS gets involved, so it really isn’t just a matter of saying absolutely nothing or calling CPS. The difference here is that these processes don’t require the school to waste resources and time and ruffle everyone’s feathers by handing out gold stars to the parents whose kids are doing fine. Instead they wait till a student exhibits a need.

Think of it this way—I pay for the roads that I use. I want them to be well-maintained and the rules enforced, but other than that leave me the hell alone. I don’t want police to waste time and money grading most people who use the public roads; I want them to react appropriately to the ones who ARE causing problems for themselves and other drivers. I’d like police to assume I’m doing okay until I give them a reason not to and keep their critiques of any non-dangerous, non-lawbreaking behavior to themselves. By the same token, I pay for the public schools I use. I want them to be well-maintained and the rules enforced, and other than that, leave me the hell alone. Assume we’re doing okay and don’t need your reassurance until my child gives you a reason to think otherwise.

@SF wow. That was …….????? O.K. after much deletion, one of the coldest things I have ever read. It is not on topic at all and seems to just be a reason to express judgement and superiorty over another parent.

You seem to have a problem with the attention Katie spends on the details of Henry’s situation and I believe you infer, her inability to move on with her life.

Here she is conducting conversation on current events very relative to being a parent interested in the course of our national education system and some how you turned it into a way to both condemn her for going on with life by registering what is going on in our country and her mission as a mother to understand how our legal system is impaired by prejudice against the circumstances of some crimes.

@SF – you go too far. Katie’s blog is a place for her to write what is on her mind and in her heart. It’s her space to sort things out. You are welcomed to your opinion, but you didn’t have to be so sharp about it. Where is your compassion? The whole “I can do everything” argument is lame, what works for some doesn’t work for others. Be nice!

@Clisby: at face value I would agree with you except that children RECEIVE GRADES based on parent’s participation. I live in Ohio and I threw an absolute fit when my kids told me that if they brought in a canned good for the food shelters, they would be given class credit. My nephew who currently has a high school freshman was told he child did not receive credit for a class project.. The reason: he did not sell enough crates of fruit for his FFA class. Because his aunts and uncles are beyond the time of their lives of being able to justify buying a crate of grapefruits his grade suffered.

Just as FYI I live in Ohio and my son is a high school math teacher which another person asked about and I just want to say that I find it ludicrous that high school teachers don’t need at least a certification in teaching in this country.

@SF — you went way too far. i believe you to have hatred in your heart.

SF, you are a seriously messed up jerk. You should never express yourself about anything, ever again. Just don’t.

JTTH, the idea of a teacher calling CPS because of unfed kids is silly, especially when there are multiple unfed, unwashed, unprepared kids in each class. What do you think CPS is going to do? Do you think they have the manpower to get involved with, say, 40% of all families in a given district? I called DHS in Philadelphia when I saw bruises on a student. They took pictures of the kid’s bruises, talked to the family, and that’s pretty much it. Unless there’s a broken bone, I doubt if they would do anything. The system is broken.

I don’t think grading parents is a good idea at all. I think it’s stupid, because it won’t make a difference. I wish I could think of something that would make a difference. I was one of those teachers waiting for parents who never showed up for report card conferences. I had a student who couldn’t pay attention because of a painful, rotting tooth in the back of her mouth, a student who came to school with a mouse in his shoe (not kidding, and it was alive), a student who came to school with a contact high in the morning, 5 year old students who would talk about what their favorite horror movies are, and other adult topics (think anal sex, etc.), 5 year old kids that would be out by themselves after dark, kids who didn’t know their own last names, and all sorts of other indicators that parental involvement was sorely lacking. Teachers are mandated to report suspected abuse and neglect, and we did. It never made a difference.

So while I don’t think this is a good idea, I do think it’s good to have a conversation about parental involvement in their kids’ education. Too often the school is blamed for students who are below standard. I’m not saying the schools don’t need to be fixed too, but home matters a lot. It has to be ok to say it out loud – some parents are seriously failing their kids.

katie- i know you blocked a certain someone, but i have a feeling that the beast may have reared her UGLY head again (somehow).

and i think you have a lot of class for your response. you’re one tough momma.

man- people really amaze me.

This is a bit off topic but in response to some of the comments. Even though I agree to some degree that one shouldn’t have more kids that one can handle, there’s something that rubs me the wrong away about people who insist that we shouldn’t have kids or limit their number in order to provide each proper attention. First of all, who decides what is “proper” amount of attention? What classifies what’s improper? Not signing your kid for sports? Reading to them only every other night? Short of things that would constitute neglect, who should be the judge of the proper attention? I am sure that a kid who wasn’t signed up for sports and whose mom didn’t attend every game/play/practice or got involved in every bake sale at school would prefer this to the alternative of not being born. (Again, I am not talking abuse/neglect here.) Second of all, circumstances change in our lives. What I thought I could handle five years ago, taking into consideration all the resources available, I might not be able to handle now in the same capacity. So if I can give “proper” attention to two kids, but have three, which one should I kill off? Life, with sicknesses, divorces, losses of jobs, etc happens. One would hope to find compassion from people around you, and some are just capable of harsh judgment and lecturing about being responsible in your reproductive choices. One would think that fellow mothers could be more understanding. Because chances are, the difference between an involved and responsible mother and the one not as involved could just one life changing event that comes out of the blue.

Staying on topic: I think it’s a silly idea, but I can see where it is coming from. I teach high school and there are so many kids whose parents neglect their parental responsibilities–sometimes because they are working so hard to put food on the table, but other times because they are out partying. And it is completely unfair to grade teachers (as is being done in many places) without also grading parents. Education only works as a partnership between home and school–if either one fails the student there is not a great deal of hope for the student.

I do find it interesting that this is a Republican proposal–it seems typical to me to use a blaming/shaming no-cost, do-nothing “fix” rather than actually put some money into addressing the socio-economic issues that are at the root of parental lack of involvement for MOST families.

I think this is hilarious. As another poster said, I think it’s a silly idea, but I see where it comes from.

Every time I see a batch of unfinished (or never started) homework I wonder what exactly parents ARE doing at night. I’m not talking about the ones who aren’t home at night because they’re working and the kid is left with a relative who doesn’t read English, or some other relative or a sitter who just doesn’t care. I’m talking about kids from homes where there is a parent at home all evening and this person speaks and reads English. I know they read and speak English because a) I’ve met them and b) they have the wherewithal to send me an outraged note about the sugary snacks served on birthdays.

That’s a real example, by the way. And I’m not criticizing the occasional missed assignment or the occasional single sheet left blank in a 6-page homework packet. I’m talking about NEVER or HARDLY ever handed in, and when I find it in their backpack (I work with little kids) it clearly never made it out of the backpack, let alone the homework folder.

C’mon parents, we can’t do it all for you.

JZZY55,

I am sick of homework, period. My son is in school from 8:20-3:20 and it takes 20 minutes to get through car pick up line. He has 20 minutes to relax and snack and on heavy homework nights he might spend 5 hours on homework. We like to eat dinner and shower (because it is nice to be fed and clean) and to fight childhood obesity and just because it centers him he is on a swim team. That is an hour of practice and 30 minutes total travel time. Granted some nights he doesn’t have 5 hours but really…the US dept of Education in all of its wisdom says 5 math problems is enough for any kid to be doing at home. My son’s teacher doesn’t understand that 20 words put into sentences is an hour long assignment. Then add on a project on a Spanish Conquistador and a book report in Reading and a science workbook page that his group didn’t finish in class and needs to be finished up OH and an essay a week that he somehow doesn’t manage to ever do in school. My kid works all day in school and just wants to ride his bike with the neighborhood kids and participate on his swim team. He just wants to be a kid in the afternoon and I think he should be allowed to do that.

I’m pretty sure *Lil Momma* hit the bullseye!

Wendi asks: but again, how are some of you comfortable with a bureaucracy having control over certain aspects of your life but yet you take such umbrage over what seems to be a trivial thing? and had earlier used having to have health care coverage as an example.

So, I’ll bite. Once many years ago a friend of a friend was whining about seat belts and helmet laws. When I pointed out that her injuries from an accident would cost ME and everyone else money, she was totally confused. She was thoroughly convinced that the few years of insurance she’d paid into the system on her behalf at that point would cover all her needs. I had to explain out the costs of emergency care, intensive care, weeks or months of rehab, possible disability payments from social security etc. would be so immense that everything she’d paid in at that point would likely be used up a day or two into her time in the hospital.

The point being that there is NO ONE who can guarantee that they’ll never need or use health care. Even if you have it tattoed on your body that you should be left without medical care at the scene of any accident, guess what, all the helpful bystanders will not likely notice that on your mangled body and you’ll still receive care. We’re humans, we’re like that.

Now, yes, you have been able to and still are able to refuse medical care, at any time. Go right ahead. But, the truth is that people who carry no insurance are paid for at some point or another by those of us who do have insurance. Your “rights” to not have insurance seem to come with the expectation that it will be my privilege to pay for you.

We live in a society. No one, not even Bill Gates or the Sultan of Brunei can guarantee that their wealth will last them forever. Can you truly not see this? If not, then go ahead, don’t carry insurance, but you know what? Don’t EVER end up in the emergency room, or with cancer, or with a chronic illness or disability needing some expensive medication that you can’t afford on your own.

I’ll happily pay my share and put it into a pot with everyone else’s share so that we can all have the basics. Besides, anyone with enough money will always be able to buy more or better or different or wander the globe looking for whatever they want.

Oh, and by the way, SF, you seem to be doing everything right….except you must have left your compassion at that terribly important bakesale.

I wonder how this mother from my city would have responded to a poor grade on her parental duties:

A Hill District woman was criminally charged for sending her shoeless 12-year-old boy outside and into the snow.
…
Police said the boy was found walking barefoot and coatless at the corner of Chauncy Street and Webster Avenue in the Hill District by a police officer at 2:22 a.m. Saturday.

A police report noted he was walking in “large amounts of snow” and the temperature at the time was 4 degrees.

Ms. Cosby was jailed and at least two of her children, including the boy, were put into the care of child welfare caseworkers.

From: http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/11023/1120179-100.stm

No…I’m wondering about the complaints of all these parents here who would send their kids to public school but not want to comply with a school’s efforts at holding parents accountable for their (young) children (ie, being held accountable). Forget it…………

Please relearn how to spell while you’re relearning 5th grade math. God forbid. Nobody can “infantilize” you (nice one) but yourself. Good grief! I fear for the state of this country with parents like those who’ve blurted their ignorance in these comments.

re: SF: Whoa. I know I can be an ass sometimes, but seriously Babble, you let that comment through? That is some heartless shit.

Does seem like a bit much, but at the same time, lack of parental involvement is one of the bigger problems in schools these days. Every single one of my curriculums and methods classes devoted a significant amount of time to figuring out of to solicit parental involvement or compensate for it; it is extremely important. You said that this will have teachers expecting more and more of parents,, but realize, we are expecting more and more from public schools all of the time, without furnishing them with more and more of the resources they need to accomplish the goals we expect. So no, I don’t really agree with grading parents, like so much educational legislation I think that it is well-meaning but that it will fail to solve the problem which it is intended to and likely cause new ones; but the line of thinking is not faulty. We are responsible for our childrens’ well-rounded development, schools are responsible only for presenting a “free and equal” education.

There are LOTS of leaps being made here…probably a combination of lacking reading comprehension and pathological defensiveness.

After reading through the comments, I was curious to read the actual legislation. I pulled it up from the Florida House of Reps and took a look. It’s pretty clear that the legislation is asking for parents to be, well parents. Check homework, make sure they’re fed, clothed, received medical care etc. It also goes on to say that there are many programs that are available to help parents assist their children. It’s pretty sad that it’s come to having legislation written to help people parent their children.

I’ve only made it a portion of the way through the comments and WOW.

I’m always amazed when I hear how different school experiences are. What always strikes me is the lack of (apparent) questioning by the parents. If you don’t understand something or you disagree with something… QUESTION IT. Teachers are human. Maybe they don’t see your perspective. Maybe they don’t know how it will impact your family. Maybe they truly have a reason for their decision. Or maybe the teacher just doesn’t care. In OUR experience… the teachers always care.

I’m not a teacher or school administrator. However it does burn me when people (like my mother) talk so harshly against teachers and administrators by making assumptions. Honestly, if you REALLY want to know what is going on at your kids school, drop in and offer to help out once and a while. Surely you can spare a couple lunch hours a month!!!! You’ll gain a whole new appreciation for your teachers!

For instance… “jenny tries too hard” wrote about her 1st grade twins and their in class assignment requiring the attendance of her and her husband. About how it took a grandparent to drive 1 hr each way to fulfill this requirement so one student didn’t get a 0. Ridiculous. Kudos to the grandparent! But if the teacher was approached about the logistics of their requirements and they weren’t willing to work with you… talk with the Principal. If they are really unwilling to work with you on something like this, there is a bigger concern.

I have twins as well. They are currently in the 3rd grade and have been in separate classes from the beginning. It was the Principals preference that they be placed in separate rooms and it was the best decision. But AGAIN – we totally questioned this from the get go and their reasoning was spot on. If we disagreed we could have asked them to be put together in the same class and they would have done so. We have never encountered a situation where their teachers or administrators haven’t listened to our questions. Is the twin thing the first thing they think about? Not really. They don’t have twins!!! Is it ever a big deal? Not at all. Does it affect their grades? Not at all. It just makes it possible for us to more easily support both kids.

I think this is completely ridiculous and would likely backfire in the places it is needed most. Do they really think that in low income areas where parents are uninvolved that they’re likely to respond well to the notion of school achievement for themselves? They likely have lousy school experiences in their history and chastising them with poor parental grades will likely only ostricise them more. Schools need to understand that parents are going to have widely varying abilities to participate in their childrens’ education. If you are functionally illiterate and your child is in first or second grade trying to read and you’re supporting him or her in whatever way you are able–even if that just means getting your kid there every day–should you be chastized for that? Should only the wealthy and educated have children because they are the only ones able to support them properly? I know that parental involvement can make a huge difference, but schools also need to know that when that child enters the front door, homework done or not, breakfasted or not, well dressed or not, they are going to have to attempt to create an environment that is nurturing and safe enough that that child can do the best he or she can. It stinks for educators that it’s this way and it’s certainly not ideal, but that is reality. Schools can’t blame parents or write off kids because their parents can’t be as supportive as they’d like them to be. They have to inspire those children to do it themselves. I grew up priveledged enough (I attended private schools for most of my academic career) but I can say that I can not remember a single, solitary time when anyone ever helped me with my homework (or even asked about it, honestly). No one ever did a project with me. I had a single, working mom and while she would feed me and get me there, the rest was entirely up to me. I struggled quite a bit for a while, but I also figured out how to do it myself. There is some value in that. For some kids, that’s reality. Let’s make sure we’re not punishing those children for something that is out of their control.

well, i actually do not think that the “proposed” legislation is ridiculous at all. ask yourselves: are you making an effort to be involved in your child’s education? let’s be honest here, i am a mother of three very young children. from my experience with my own kids and listening to other parents talk, many of them want time to themselves to do what they want to do. i get that. however, as a teacher myself (currently not working), many parents are very lax when it comes to staying abreast about what is going on with their kids in their classrooms. it is obvious that the more you show your children you want to be part of what they are doing in school, the more successful they will become. everyone needs to take that time and find out what’s going on. i can’t volunteer as much right now because i have a two year-old, but once in a while, my husband will take a couple hours off of work so that one of us can go to a conference at the school, read a book, etc. both of us are educators ourselves and research has proven that parental involvement makes a difference.

Thank you to the public school teachers who commented on this post with some perspective about the reality of public education. The rest of you should find a couple of hours to volunteer at a public school working with kids who come from homes where their education is not a priority. This is 2011, not 1975 folks. The problems faced by the system are very different. The flaws of the system are numerous as many of you have pointed out.

Consider the possibility that the proposed legislation and possible future implementation of such a parental grading system might evolve into a situation where the responsibility for educating your children becomes one that is shared by parents and teachers. Oh my! What a concept!

The future of public education is pretty grim if parents continue to get to be the good guys, showering their kiddos with video games and sugary treats, allowing them to watch countless hours of inappropriate television so they can be further distracted from the realities that do in fact exist in the world they live in and will inherit.

Get off your high horses and look at the real problems being faced by public educators in a self absorbed, instant gratification, what are you going to do for me, it’s your fault world of parents. The lack of parental responsibility in many children’s education knows no socio-economic boundaries. Parents have lots of choices, like set an example, and keep your expectations high. I have two middle school aged kids who are receiving an education at a prestigious private school. Both attend on a full financial aid scholarship. They are not there because we can afford it. They are there because they are being raised in an environment that places the highest priority on education, they have been taught to respect and be grateful for the institution they attend (even when it was public), and as parents we know the material world of distractions is not going to compliment their formal education.

Simplify. Turn off the TV. Get rid of the video games. Engage yourself in raising your kids. You’ll be amazed at the happy, well adjusted and academically high achieving kids you can raise. It doesn’t cost a lot of money, doesn’t require you to be at their school regularly, and won’t interfere with your career if you take the responsibility you should have signed on for when you decided to give birth.

I believe the proposed legislation may in part an effort to protect teachers. Federal, state and local governments have spent the better part of the last 15 years making teachers more and more accountable for the achievement level of students and have not spent anytime outlining the role of the parent in the child’s education. I know there are many teachers who should retire or find another profession, but the fact is that there seems to be no end to what educators are being asked to be responsible for when it comes to raising our nation’s children.
Even though I work part to full time, I have spent countless hours volunteering in the public school system when my children attended there. I worked not in my kid’s classrooms, but with whatever students were assigned to me because they were not on grade level in math or reading. Some were from families who live at or below the poverty line, but many were from middle class families. Many of these middle class kids are doped up on ADD and ADHD meds and all they can talk about is video games and television shows. They don’t read outside of school but they have the latest and greatest games for the Wii and even have facebook accounts! They may be receiving A’s and B’s on their report card because the curriculum is so easy, but now that the practice of dumbing down the standardized tests has been exposed and reversed, these kids have gone from 90th percentile to 40th! Guess who mom and dad are slinging the blame at?
Bottom line, education, especially in grades k-3, begins, is reinforced, and ends in the home. The 6 hours kids spend in school being herded like cats is merely a compliment to what must be a priority at home.
The parent involvement outlined in the proposed legislation has nothing to do with who bakes cupcakes, sews costumes or eats lunch with their kids. Anyone who interprets it that way has some serious guilt and probable jealousy. You can’t have it all, plain and simple. What you can do, no matter what your income or education level or family situation, is keep your expectations high for your kids’ academic success and communicate that to your child. If your kid is middle school age and tells you they never have homework, you ought to make a phone call to find out why. If your kid falls short of your and his teacher’s expectations for what he/she is capable of, make sure there are immediate consequences. No one is being asked to do their child’s homework with them. Parental accountability means communicating with your student, the teacher and the system to keep your kid headed in the right direction.
Lastly, I am really confused about many of the opinions Katie stated in her post as her children attend a private school and this legislation is directed and intended for the public education sector. But, that which gets people fired up makes money for the blogger.

When your little ones embark on their early public elementary school years Katie, you will likely experience far less competition, if any, in terms of whose or how many mommies volunteer. In many public elementary schools, there are so few parents able to give any time at all, that those that are able to help are a godsend. We working moms are very grateful for the time any parents give helping teachers with the extras while they attend to the completion of a gazillion reports to tell every branch of government how Sally, Dick and Jane are doing academically, socially, and developmentally. Public school budgets are being slashed all over the place and many public elementary schools in your area of town don’t even have an adequate paper supply to last them a school year. If a mom wants to sell candy bars to raise money for a school, I’m all for it. At a private school the dollars raised might buy something fancy. At a public school it might buy basic supplies. If this is the gift she brings to the table, aren’t we lucky.
More importantly, the elementary school years are critical in the formation of every student’s attitude about completion of his schoolwork. Very early on in a child’s development, parents set the bar as to their expectations in all areas of his/her behavior. The proposed grade given to parents by teachers would simply be an indication of how the school assesses the height of your family’s academic achievement bar and whether it’s satisfies, exceeds, or falls below what is necessary to meet the accountability standards set by the government for teachers and schools. It’s plain and simple. If a parental grade giving pursuit showed evidence of being used to intimidate or of being nepotistic in nature, there would be obvious consequences for the school, public or private. If your child’s test scores are average to above, and you receive a parent grade that is inappropriate for his/her level of achievement, there would be an important need for dialog between the home and the school, right? Dialog is great.

I enjoy your blog on many occasions Katie, but I feel that with this post you may have been trying to stir up the angry mob again to boost business and you did so at the expense of rational analysis of an important issue in which children are the immediate victims. The issue of the proposed Florida legislation should be discussed with focus on the severely broken public education system and the real victims of it. Your personal feelings of “intimidation”, your opinions as to what is hyper parenting, and your judgements about your fellow mothers’ life choices not only belittles a very serious subject, but pits women against each other. If you haven’t read Perfect Madness, Motherhood in the Age of Anxiety, it will enlighten you as to the consequences of this type of divisive rhetoric between women. http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=4555223
Your parenting insecurities got in the way of your intelligent discussion in this post. Ok, we all have them and this is the kind of place they get revealed.
Please don’t however, complicate this already complex problem of monstrous size with a ‘who is hyper parenting war’ because that is the furthest thing from the problem or the solution. Whether it be your analysis of the degree to which individual families involve themselves in a child’s educational endeavors, or the scrutiny of the amount of personal responsibility some kids are able to take on as opposed to other kids, neither is at all a direction that we want to take this particular discussion if we hope to build a functioning public education system in America. It’s not about you the “working outside the home mom” or you the “mom who volunteers in the community” or the grade either of you receives from your child’s teacher. It’s about building partnerships and bringing up our collective standard when it comes to educating our nation’s children. More experience in the public education arena at the elementary school level will give you a much more realistic picture of the need for parental involvement at the PreK-3rd Grade level in terms of setting the bar at home at the necessary height to achieve grade level academic success.
Kids don’t look back when they reach adult-hood and remember who made the cupcakes or the costumes, shelved library books or came to lunch once a week. They remember who taught them to be disciplined about their education, who motivated and challenged them to be their best, who cared enough to push back against their resistance with love and consequences.
It takes a village, united.